Do you want an icon competition?

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Moderators: white, Hacker, petermad, Stefan2

How should we decide on new icons in TC?

With an icon design competition.
37
41%
By using the icons from user "StickyNomad" as a base.
25
27%
By hiring a professional designer. Please make suggestions below.
8
9%
Other (please specify below).
2
2%
I don't care, the current icons are OK.
19
21%
 
Total votes: 91

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ghisler(Author)
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Post by *ghisler(Author) »

The problem is that forum users disliked the idea of hiring a professional designer - only 11% opted for this solution. The legal concerns about a competition have been rised mainly after the poll was started. So currently I'm at a dead point, I can neither start a competition nor ask a professional designer. :(
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Post by *Hacker »

What about StickyNomad's icons?

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Post by *ghisler(Author) »

I like them, but I have already read comments from users that they are too much Windows 2000 style...
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Post by *karlchen »

About StickyNomad's icon collections:
ghisler(Author) wrote:I like them, but I have already read comments from users that they are too much Windows 2000 style...
Hm, true, yet . . . better having a Windows 2000 style Commander than a Windows 3.x style Commander. :wink:
(This is just my point of view, of course. As a matter of fact, I am using IconLib=XPDreams.icl and some of StickyNomad's icons in the buttonbar.)

Ok, back to the initial target of this poll:
If for legal reasons, it will not be possible to include user made ICL files in the official TC installation package, this leaves us with 3 alternatives:

(1) By hiring a professional designer.

(2) Using the icons from user "StickyNomad" as a base.*

(3) I don't care, the current icons are OK.

Could we not repeat this poll with just these 3 alternatives and then see how users decide?

Kind regards,
Karl
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* Provided StickyNomad's collection meets all copyright requirements.
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Post by *pdavit »

ghisler(Author) wrote:The problem is that forum users disliked the idea of hiring a professional designer - only 11% opted for this solution. The legal concerns about a competition have been rised mainly after the poll was started. So currently I'm at a dead point, I can neither start a competition nor ask a professional designer. :(
Well, it looks as if the professional designer's solution is becoming a one way street in order to exclude the
licensing implications.

The reason probably why this is not a popular poll result is not because of the possible resulted quality but
in my opinion because it sounds too good to be true, if you know what I mean, and because many users may speculate
that the cost will have some other "side effects".
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Must be solved!

Post by *Clo »

2pdavit
:) Hello Panos !
…but in my opinion because it sounds too good to be true…
- Indeed, I agree ! The issue here is also to define how many icons must be in a new set. With regard to the huge amount of internal commands, this amount should be so high - even including only the most used by the most users, that is also another issue, very ticklish to solve…-
- For instance, I use always my own icons, and I've something like 240 ones for 32*32 only, mainly for the internal commands able to be installed with buttons…
- With even, let's say, only 100 icons for $50 each, this is already a pretty wad of bank-notes…
- So, why not the StickyNomad's ones (for the common benefits, not for my own using), with a kind of licence between him and Ch. Ghisler to solve the legal problems, even with a symbolic fee ? Anyway, I think that this issue must be solved, the actual icons are a handicap by their look for candidate-users who just give a try to the program, and close and uninstall it quickly because that…

:mrgreen:  Frendly,
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Last edited by Clo on 2005-04-12, 20:12 UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by *pdavit »

2Clo

> So, why not the StickyNomad's ones, with a kind of licence between him and Ch. Ghisler to solve the legal problems, even with a symbolic fee?

Because licensing can be very complex and not fully understanding software laws (which by the way may vary on each country) can be catastrophic! I'm sure that our beloved StickyNomad provided his own genuine work but what if icon licensing can go down to legally holding an icon design software? That is what I mean by not fully understanding software laws. :(


> Anyway, I think that this issue must be solved, the actual icons are a handicap by their look for candidate-users who just give a try to the program, and close and uninstall it quickly because that

So very true!
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Post by *ghisler(Author) »

Well, the price isn't really the problem, don't worry. I will certainly not have to increase the price of TC for this.

One problem is to find a designer with a design which pleases to most users. What would you suggest? As a first step, we should gather designers, and then either make a poll directly on choosing the designer, or asking each designer to design let's say 2 icons on which users can decide which they like the best. What do you think?
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Samples : OK

Post by *Clo »

2ghisler(Author)
:) Good evening,

- I like the principle of samples from designers, hoping they could draw specific TC-icons samples, more expressive to make a choice, I think… For instance, for the ticklish issue : "Thumb-nails", and also a non-usual "Pack files" ;)

:mrgreen: m.f.G.
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Post by *ghisler(Author) »

Yes, we also need to decide _which_ icons should be done as samples by the designers.
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Post by *pdavit »

ghisler(Author) wrote:One problem is to find a designer with a design which pleases to most users. What would you suggest? As a first step, we should gather designers, and then either make a poll directly on choosing the designer, or asking each designer to design let's say 2 icons on which users can decide which they like the best. What do you think?
I support this methodology as long as designers are willing to spend time and effort with the chance of being rejected and as long as they are willing to have the sample work viewed publicly for voting!

If you need me to remind you of the offers, please, let me know. But you will find them in the related thread over the beta forum and some additional here.

I guess we should select icons related strictly to TC features so that it will be something new for the developers. Icons like packing or arrows or reloading or folders and the like can be found virtually on the majority of applications and will not show something new other than just the artists' general concept.

So, to sum up we probably need:

1. Two distinctive and strictly TC-related icons, e.g. branched view, custom columns, multi-renaming.
2. An individual description of the function each icon will encapsulate for the designers to understand the concept behind what the icon will represent.
3. The technical specifications for the icons, e.g. size 32x32, color depth 256
4. The artistic specifications, e.g. simplicity, intuitive, distinctive
5. A statement for the designers that their sample work will probably become available for voting and viewed by many users.

I strongly believe that a key element should be that the icons should have a unified look'n'feel if you like being at the same time distinctive (yet not complicated) so that the application could be immediately recognized widely by its icons. Everybody knows how Adobe Acrobat icons look like, for example, don't they? What I call as key elements (i.e. unified look, distinctive and inornate) can be illustrated for example here: http://cgi.glyphlab.com/php/gl/icon_design/examples.php (btw, this is one of the designers that offered to take the project).

Observe how the Quadrate and Endorphin icons, for example, follow my "three key elements" of Distinctiveness, Simplicity, Unification.
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Post by *Stance »

I downloaded and installed StickyNomads icons.
The best I have have ever seen for Total Commander !
Big thanks to StickyNomad for that, great work, go ahead !
A professional designer couldt not make it better.
It is well designed from the first to the last, very intuitive.
I would like to see more of them...
In my opinion the old icons should be replaced with them.

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A good test !

Post by *Clo »

2pdavit
:) Hello Panos !
…Icons like packing or arrows or reloading or folders and the like can be found virtually on the majority of applications…
- I don't wish to launch a polemical with you here but I disagree about "Packing". This is a specific built-in function of TC. And using icons similar to the ones we can see in packer-programs'll fall quickly in the "goofy-hood"…
- IMHO, a clever designer able to find a better idea than this one should win the jackpot! The same for "Unpacking"…
- For equal drawing qualities, I would prefer certainly a set showing a research of original features.
- Other covering questions would be :
¤ What colour-depth?
¤ Could we use the future icons in the 16-bit version? Or not ? Or is a new set needed too for that 16-bit version?
¤ Multi-framed icons, to get 2 sizes or more ? Might be more expensive…
Etc., etc. …

:mrgreen:  Friendly,
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Re: A good test !

Post by *pdavit »

Clo wrote:I don't wish to launch a polemical with you here but I disagree about "Packing".
You simply cannot break a long friendship based on a tinny icon disagreement! ;) :P :D
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Post by *Sam_Zen »

Maybe I am an opportunist, but, seen all the problems concerning artwork, payments and copyright, it seems more efficient to me to leave things as they are : TC has its icons, and there are external possibilities to add or replace icons by other ones.
In my case, I use some of the default TC ones for functions, others has been replaced by those fine ones of StickyNomad,
and other icons I have made myself linking to sub-bars, like 'sys', to apps that are scarcely used, but must be available. (As a standard for a return in such a sub-bar to the main default bar I use the TC icon itself.)
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