radical breadcrumbs change?

[Samuel]

Mh I tried around with the new breadcrumbs bar. Im not getting warm with it. Until now I was used to click on a folder in the path to switch to it. I am not able to use the breadcrumbs bar in a faster way then before.

I hope the following suggestions come not to late. (because one of them is a basic one - see poll)

1. I dont like that the content of an folder is shown. What about to show the alternative folders. (See Picture 1) This has the following reason:

• A) The content of the last folder is already shown in the file panel. (no need to change it this way)
  B) Clicking the drive Letter is really hard. (to change the first level folder on the drive) The new way would change a drive to another one, what is not necessarily to be done this way.

Code: Select all

Example: For now to change from "C:\Example1\Example2\" to "C:\Example3\" you have to hit this small "C:\". With my suggestion you have to hit "Example1" and choose "Example3".

2. If I use "cm_SrcPathFocus" (btw. strange name for activating breadcrumbs bar) I would like to have selected the folder on the far right, instead of being able to choose "desktop", "my computer", "network" etc.

3. I would like when activating breadcrumbs bar: (with cm_SrcPathFocus) that the menu of breadcrumbs bar is open immediately. With suggestion of Number 1 I would propose current folder is preselected.

4. I would like when pressing left in a one level menu of breadcrumbs bar that the menu doesnt close, but the menu of the parent folder is opened instead (with preselected subfolder)

See third and fourth point in Picture 2

[Lefteous]

1. This sounds interesting and could actually add one level and solve the limited desktop representation without requiring more width (which is critical). I just wonder why I didn't have this idea. especially because the breadcrumb menu is displayed below a folder
2. This has been discussed during the beta test. It's really difficult to say if the current dir or the root dirs are more likely targets. After all it's a single cursor left press to the current directory. When applying your first suggestion it could make sense to change this to "current sibling folder".
3. This means supplying the currently (relatively new) option also for keyboard users - a logical step. There could be one problem though. If the arroe button are completely removed the hotkey handling could no longer work in the same way or do you mean just open the contents by default and still displaying arrow buttons?
4. I guess this would be the same as 3 as it behaves like that when using the mouse for breadcrumb handling.

To answer the initial question: I already use the breadcrumb menu a lot. Especially the first suggestion needs to be tested and I cannot say without using it if I wouls use it.

BTW: Your thread title sounds shocking. I have seen much larger changes during the private betatest. These are really good refinement ideas though.

[Samuel]

This has been discussed during the beta test. It's really difficult to say if the current dir or the root dirs are more likely targets. After all it's a single cursor left press to the current directory. When applying your first suggestion it could make sense to change this to "current sibling folder".

This is what I had in mind.

3. This means supplying the currently (relatively new) option also for keyboard users - a logical step. There could be one problem though. If the arroe button are completely removed the hotkey handling could no longer work in the same way or do you mean just open the contents by default and still displaying arrow buttons?

I had in mind to open the breadcrumbs bar by keyboard (I prefer simple "left" key for now) and have immediately this. Then when I press "left" I want the different drives for selection in the same way. (drive e preselected) Or in other cases the parent folder of the initial folder.

The Arrow should be used for mouse only.
Mh, dont know if I got you right on Number 3.

[Lefteous]

I had in mind to open the breadcrumbs bar by keyboard (I prefer simple "left" key for now) and have immediately this. Then when I press "left" I want the different drives for selection in the same way. (drive e preselected) Or in other cases the parent folder of the initial folder.

Currently when the arrow button is displayed you can use left/right/home/end to change the dir level. Keys are different when a breadcrumb menu is opened.
So the current dir element must be still available for navigation and to be able to change to the underlined dir - with or without arrow button.

[Samuel]

To clarify I added this Picture to the first post.
It shows how I think a perfect breadcrumbs navigation is.

I know that currently keys are not as I proposed.
Hope I understood you now.

[Lefteous]

I think I understood your suggestion immediately.

I know that currently keys are not as I proposed.

This problems must be solved or your suggestion cannot be implemented.

[Samuel]

You dont mean the arrow in the breadcrumbs bar, but the ones under the directorys, right?

Would you give me an example please? What is not possible then? Or explain it in German for me. Sorry. I just dont get the point. I read it over and over again.

[Lefteous]

OK next try. The current dir is:
C:\Users\Username\Pictures\Holiday\2008

Current behavior:
1. User activates breadcrumb bar.
2. User wants to display contents of Pictures and moves the cursor to "Pictures" by pressing right several times.
3. User opens breadcrumb menu by pressing down key.
4. User reconsiders to browse from root dir.
5. User presses escape to close the breadcrumb menu.
6. User presses Home to go to root dir.
7. User presses down to open to open the root dir contents.


Suggested behavior.
1. User activates breadcrumb bar. The breadcrumb menu display siblings of "2008".
2. User wants to display contents of Pictures so he presses left key once. The siblings of Holiday are displayed.
3. User reconsiders to browse root.
4. To be continued by Samuel...

Another problem: Not all breadcrumb menus are opened to the right. When the window edge is reached menus are opened to the left and can only be closed by pressing left. Another key for dir up would have to be used. Backspace is the natural choice.

[Samuel]

4. User takes a sleep on the left key.

Home and end currently go to first and last item in menu. Page up and down could be used for that. Home could be used to go to root and end to last folder. (old open menu is replaced by new one then)

Another problem: Not all breadcrumb menus are opened to the right. When the window edge is reached menus are opened to the left and can only be closed by pressing left. Another key for dir up would have to be used. Backspace is the natural choice.

No. Just tried it. You can always use the left key to switch to parent folder in breadcrumb menu right now. (good decision)

[fenix_productions]

2Samuel
I have chosen"I don't care option" to fast.

After reading your post few times I have to say it is worth to check. Most of the pros and cons has been well written by Lefteous so there is rather nothing to add.

Keep in mind: Support++ from my side.

2Lefteous
I wonder why it's not yours too

[lpg]

I'm sorry but I don't get it at the moment why a change to 1.) would be so much better. You mean to get the folders shown one level up of the folders I'm just in - the same I get if I clicking one folder to the left (in breadcr.)?

To be honest I played around with this idea (just clicked the folder to the left on Breadc instead the folder I'm in) and found it a bit confusing if deeper in the folder hierarchy. Also what would happen if the folder one level up has no other subfolders?

Apart from that: To go quickly down several folderleves in my current folder (which is great and much faster with the breadc as is is now instead of clicking in the file panel - at least for me) I first have to got to the right in the breadcr. (the "*.*" which isn't working - yet?) then go back to the folder I'm already in... etc. it is even confusing to describe ))

But I also see that this could be helpful sometimes (or the best way for lots of TC-Users) so why not make this optional? Or use shift-click or right click on breadr. or hovering over the [..] (the line between the column-headers and the first file/folder - sorry, don't know what it is called). Or even an extra button.

I really hope that the current behaviour will be kept or at least be made an option because as it is now it is exactly how I would like to have it.

Btw. Thanks for your great work Mr. Ghisler

[Lefteous]

Apart from that: To go quickly down several folderleves in my current folder (which is great and much faster with the breadc as is is now instead of clicking in the file panel - at least for me) I first have to got to the right in the breadcr. (the "*.*" which isn't working - yet?) then go back to the folder I'm already in... etc. it is even confusing to describe

That's of course a point. I guess Samuel assumes that users will continue to navigate to subfolders using file panels. Otherwise an additional step is required.
*.* could be used to display stored custom views in a list

[Samuel]

Also what would happen if the folder one level up has no other subfolders?

The menu just would have 1 entry. (like now)

I always understood my first suggestion as a optional one. Has pros and cons...

btw: I would rather see number 2, 3 and 4 implemented. This would be really great! Number 1 would be a nice to have optional behavior.

Btw. Thanks for your great work Mr. Ghisler

Absolutely.

[lpg]

...users will continue to navigate to subfolders using file panels

But isn't that the main purpose of breadcrumbs?

I just checked but as far as I can see other filemanagers like D-Opus or Speedcommander show only the (sub)folders + archives of the clicked breadcr. without submenus. There you are faster when using the file panel to go (down) in your folder hierarchy.

I have tweaked my breadcrumb settings to work without delay and so I'm as fast in some nested subfolders as I can move my mouse around. Just great!!!

[Lefteous]

But isn't that the main purpose of breadcrumbs?

Not necessarily - you could use breadcrumbs when starting above the current level and still navigate to subdirs with panels when starting from the current dir.