TC 8 Final must be called "The Smart"

eugensyl · Post by *eugensyl » 2011-10-21, 08:31 UTC

Many applications now are Smart (

).

What does is mean?

They automatically install apps in your PC's language and picks the right 32 or 64-bit version.

The size is irrelevant now.

I think that Total Commander is the Smartest application on the Earth.
Do you think so?

MVV · Post by *MVV » 2011-10-21, 08:38 UTC

If size is irrelevant for you, it doesn'r mean that it is irrelevant for others.

And, 32-bit TC works fine in 64-bit OS, so someone may want to install 32-bit version in 64-bit OS.

Sir_SiLvA · Post by *Sir_SiLvA » 2011-10-21, 09:02 UTC

MVV wrote:If size is irrelevant for you, it doesn'r mean that it is irrelevant for others.

That

MVV wrote:And, 32-bit TC works fine in 64-bit OS, so someone may want to install 32-bit version in 64-bit OS.

Especially when you use a lot of Plugins that are only avail as 32Bit...

eugensyl · Post by *eugensyl » 2011-10-21, 09:29 UTC

MVV wrote:If size is irrelevant for you, it doesn'r mean that it is irrelevant for others.

And, 32-bit TC works fine in 64-bit OS, so someone may want to install 32-bit version in 64-bit OS.

I respect your point of view.
But is not the only one.
And this is a debate.

Sooner or later, the applications become smarter enough to bring the right decisions, as you see at tablet PCs, which are based on sensors (variables).

On the other hand, why would somebody install the 32-bit TC on a 64-bit OS version? Just to remember the past?

I know, few of us will try, but common people who use TC will not experiment it.

For example, why do you want to use MS Office 2000 instead of Office
2007/2010? With the first you have more pain, less compatibility and so on.

Of course, you have some habits with the old software. But this is valid ONLY for you. New users don't know about the old interface of the software, and that is right.

So my proposal is ONE SETUP FILE with a radio button ONLY on 64-bit OS on the first step of installation (into the final version only). In this way, EVERY CUSTOMER/USER will know about the great leap from the previous version (32-bit to 64-bit of TC) and will appreciate it. Otherwise only TC fans will know the difference.

Sir_SiLvA · Post by *Sir_SiLvA » 2011-10-21, 10:04 UTC

2eugensyl
Sorry but why would anyone want to use the 64Bit Version atm?
because he wants to use a blank TC WITHOUT any Plugins?
TC64 can ONLY use 64Bit Plugins and as most plugins are not (yet)
avail for 64Bit theres no use in using TC64Bit much apart from testing
(Yep I know there are a few...)

And you seriously come with the realy bad question of MS Office?
I Still use Office 2000 cause the Menu in the new Versions has gone sh** - and your point about combatibility is fake u can always save Offcie documents so it can be read by older versions....

As stated before often enough if you are smart enough to use a filemanager you should be smart enough to be able to read a homepage and not let the computer do the thinking for you (cause in that case you DONT need a filemanager at all)

karlchen · Post by *karlchen » 2011-10-21, 10:46 UTC

Q: Why would anybody wish to use Total Commander 64-bit on 64-bit Windows?

A: For the same reason that we run 32-bit Total Commander and 32-bit applications in general on 32-bit Windows and not 16-bit software. 64-bit OSes are made for running 64-bit applications primarily.

Q:Will a user of Total Commander 64-bit really have to live without most of his plugins for the foreseeable future?

A: The answer largely depends on which plugins he really depends on. I.e. there is no simple yes/no answer to this question.

The point about available 64-bit plugins really is this:
The number of available 64-bit plugins is not 0.
The number of available 64-bit plugins is growing.
No-one can tell which of the not yet existing 64-bit plugins will really be missed.

Q:Why in the world have T.C. users been urging Christian into finally offering Total Commander 64-bit, but now reject the idea of really installing and using Total Commander 64-bit?

A: I have got no real idea.

Q: Does this imply that you support Eugensyl's suggestion?

A: Yes, the general idea is all right. Details of implementation may have to be thought upon a bit.

eugensyl · Post by *eugensyl » 2011-10-21, 10:51 UTC

@Sir_SiLvA

I agree with you about MS office. It wasn't the best example.
Have you know something about marketing?
I suppose, yes.
I remember, as you know, TC is not freeware. So, it's not enought to be good. It must be the best.
Have you see the Google trends about Total Commander words?
Do you know what Kotler said about a business?
Business=Customers

NEW CUSTOMERS!

And I want also versions 9, 10, 11... and so on from mr. Ghisler.
Not just for fun... Already a lot of TC versions (for smartphones, for Android...) are free.

Have you see a new customer already educated about a new product?
I don't think so.

A new customer will pay ONLY for perceived value for him.

But I don't want to convince you. Again, it's my point of view.
When you have doubt, make a poll.

Finally, it's for the FINAL 8-th VERSION (not beta) when a lot of plugins will work on 64-bit version of TC - I suppose.

BTW, the warning messages of TC can be also triggers for un-licensed users to become legal users.

Sir_SiLvA · Post by *Sir_SiLvA » 2011-10-21, 11:26 UTC

2eugensyl
If you DONT think TC is the best then why do so many 2-Window-Filemanager try to get Users from TC by building in support for TC Plugins?

No when TC8 finall not the Plugins will work for TC64 - for TC64 the Plugins only work when they are REDONE too...

MVV · Post by *MVV » 2011-10-21, 11:33 UTC

Sir_SiLvA wrote:If you DONT think TC is the best then why do so many 2-Window-Filemanager try to get Users from TC by building in support for TC Plugins?

I think main reason is that there are tooooooo much TC plugins, so it allows to extend filemanager functionality.

theosdikaios · Post by *theosdikaios » 2011-10-21, 11:38 UTC

Q: Why would anybody wish to use Total Commander 64-bit on 64-bit Windows?

A: For the same reason that we run 32-bit Total Commander and 32-bit applications in general on 32-bit Windows and not 16-bit software. 64-bit OSes are made for running 64-bit applications primarily.

Ahem - 16-bit software is limited to 8.3 filenames, 64kByte linear address space ... i.e. IMHO it isn't a matching analogy.

Of course it would be nice to have a smart TCmd (installation routine) that would choose the best parameters in a specific environment.

Post by *ghisler(Author) » 2011-10-21, 11:47 UTC

16-bit software is limited to 8.3 filenames, 64kByte linear address space ... i.e. IMHO it isn't a matching analogy.

Not true, ever tried TC 16 bit?

64-bit OSes are made for running 64-bit applications primarily.

Not true for the AMD64 extension (which is also used by Intel processors): The run 32-bit and 64-bit software equally well, and in most cases with the same speed. You will not see a big difference between TC 32-bit and 64-bit.

The main reason is to use 64-bit Explorer extensions for programs where the developers are too lazy to also install the 32-bit extension (which DOES exist for 32-bit Windows anyway).

theosdikaios · Post by *theosdikaios » 2011-10-21, 12:08 UTC

Quote:
16-bit software is limited to 8.3 filenames, 64kByte linear address space ... i.e. IMHO it isn't a matching analogy.

Not true, ever tried TC 16 bit?

Yep, but on W3.11 only.

All other 16 bit software which I had to use on >W95 were limited ...

Sir_SiLvA · Post by *Sir_SiLvA » 2011-10-21, 12:10 UTC

theosdikaios wrote:Of course it would be nice to have a smart TCmd (installation routine) that would choose the best parameters in a specific environment.

Isnt that wrong and should be choosen by the USER not the Installer?

User A wants only the newest stuff and only wants 64Bit-TC
User B wants only 32Bit-TC as he sees to many flaws in Lazerus
User C wants both installed because there is this ONE office Plugin that doesnt exists for TC64Bit
So how does an INSTALLER decide wich to install?
I think 2 Installers for each is a good compromise
(I know some people say size doesnt matter these days wich is a lie in times of umts and lte internet)

(Dont look at me

I am User D that cant be bothered with an Installer at all since im using my Tool for updating only changed TC files [http://home.arcor.de/gelber.elefant/tcupdater.zip] - so all I do hope that the Installer will allways be unpackable)

MVV wrote:I think main reason is that there are tooooooo much TC plugins, so it allows to extend filemanager functionality.

to much? not true how can anything good be too much

eugensyl · Post by *eugensyl » 2011-10-21, 12:24 UTC

Sir_SiLvA wrote:
theosdikaios wrote:Of course it would be nice to have a smart TCmd (installation routine) that would choose the best parameters in a specific environment.
...
User C wants both installed because there is this ONE office Plugin that doesnt exists for TC64Bit
...
So how does an INSTALLER decide wich to install?

Run INSTALLER twice!

It's quite simple.

Just imagine...

ADD: YES! You can install TC in the same directory.

Post by *Hacker » 2011-10-22, 13:57 UTC

karlchen

Q:Why in the world have T.C. users been urging Christian into finally offering Total Commander 64-bit, but now reject the idea of really installing and using Total Commander 64-bit?

Were those the same users?

Roman