Hello,
Today I noticed something with Total CMD.
I recently bought a USB Flash disk. I always use TCMD, and I was very disappointed when I see the extremely slow copy speed to the USB flash drive. I was so disappointed I even made the shop replace the drive. The new one was also slow.
Then I noticed something. When copying (copy+paste) via Windows Explorer, the transfer is much faster. There is maybe a 6x - 8x speed difference between transferring via TCDM and Windows Explorer. I verified this using 3 different computers.
I feel that must be somehow related to the copy block size or something, but I have no clear idea. Anyone with a similar experience?
Best wishes,
Very slow copies when using USB Flash drive
Moderators: Hacker, petermad, Stefan2, white
I had a similar experience, but it had nothing to do with Total Commander.
I recently bought a USB flash drive too, and was similarly surprised at the low speeds
. Then I did some research on the subject.
I realized that the USB flash drive came formatted as FAT by default (maybe to make it as compatible as possible with earlier Windows versions).
My HDD is NTFS and apparently Windows XP has some sort of problem when dealing with a large number of small files in a FAT drive.
See this link for a more detailed explanation about that.
I don't know if this applies to your case or not. Maybe you can check if your USB flash drive is formatted as FAT. The performance of mine improved noticeably when I reformatted it as NTFS.
I don't know either if the copy mechanisms of TC have anything to do with this behaviour, but it should be interesting to find out.
In any case this may be a good tip for anyone who's having problems with Windows XP and a USB flash drive. If you're not going yo use the Flash drive with a PC using Win9x, then you should format the drive as NTFS.
I recently bought a USB flash drive too, and was similarly surprised at the low speeds
. Then I did some research on the subject.I realized that the USB flash drive came formatted as FAT by default (maybe to make it as compatible as possible with earlier Windows versions).
My HDD is NTFS and apparently Windows XP has some sort of problem when dealing with a large number of small files in a FAT drive.
See this link for a more detailed explanation about that.
I don't know if this applies to your case or not. Maybe you can check if your USB flash drive is formatted as FAT. The performance of mine improved noticeably when I reformatted it as NTFS.
I don't know either if the copy mechanisms of TC have anything to do with this behaviour, but it should be interesting to find out.
In any case this may be a good tip for anyone who's having problems with Windows XP and a USB flash drive. If you're not going yo use the Flash drive with a PC using Win9x, then you should format the drive as NTFS.
[face=courier]On 28-03-2004 03:07:42 +0000 Janus wrote:
J> If you're not going yo use the Flash drive with a PC using
J> Win9x, then you should format the drive as NTFS.
And lost at least 12% of precious space for MFT zone?! >8[~~~] Well, IMHO it's not a good idea.[/face]
J> If you're not going yo use the Flash drive with a PC using
J> Win9x, then you should format the drive as NTFS.
And lost at least 12% of precious space for MFT zone?! >8[~~~] Well, IMHO it's not a good idea.[/face]
[face=courier]The Protoss do NOT run from their enemies.
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
[face=courier]On 28-03-2004 03:07:42 +0000 leventp wrote:
l> I recently bought a USB Flash disk.
Is it USB 2.0 w/ OTi controller BTW?
l> I always use TCMD, and I was very disappointed when I see
l> the extremely slow copy speed to the USB flash drive.
Well, there is an article on iXBT about this subject with a lot of explanations, but in brief you should unable compatibility mode for your USB drive.[/face]
l> I recently bought a USB Flash disk.
Is it USB 2.0 w/ OTi controller BTW?
l> I always use TCMD, and I was very disappointed when I see
l> the extremely slow copy speed to the USB flash drive.
Well, there is an article on iXBT about this subject with a lot of explanations, but in brief you should unable compatibility mode for your USB drive.[/face]
[face=courier]The Protoss do NOT run from their enemies.
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
Yes, it is a USB 2.0 one, but I'm not sure about the controller. The disk is a Sandisk Cruzer Mini 256MB. Very small, very nice designed, with a nice price.
Many thanks, it looks like in this article they talk about the thing I'm experiencing, but as it is in Russian, I don't understand what does it say. Anyway, I'll just enable compability mode for that drive.
http://ixbt.com/storage/flashdrives-p10-tcerror.shtml
Thanks a lot
Many thanks, it looks like in this article they talk about the thing I'm experiencing, but as it is in Russian, I don't understand what does it say. Anyway, I'll just enable compability mode for that drive.
http://ixbt.com/storage/flashdrives-p10-tcerror.shtml
Thanks a lot
That's reserved space, not committed, ie when free space is low, parts of the that zone may be used.Black Dog wrote:at least 12% of precious space for MFT zone
The reason this is done is simply because of the severe performance degradation of a fragmented MFT, so a certain amount of space is reserved ahead of time to ensure that the MFT will be contiguious.
When I say reserved I actually mean 'reserved until needed'.
[face=courier]On 28-03-2004 23:34:52 +0000 leventp wrote:
l> Yes, it is a USB 2.0 one, but I'm not sure about the
l> controller. The disk is a Sandisk Cruzer Mini 256MB.
Never saw that thing (as for me I prefer the JetFlash from Transcend) but something tells me it does use OTi controller... :)
l> it looks like in this article they talk about the thing I'm
l> experiencing, but as it is in Russian, I don't understand
l> what does it say
Well, I made a translation, didn't I? :)
l> I just enabled the compability mode for my flash drive and
l> now it flies.
Well, naturally.
l> Many thanks from Istanbul.
Be my guest :).[/face]
l> Yes, it is a USB 2.0 one, but I'm not sure about the
l> controller. The disk is a Sandisk Cruzer Mini 256MB.
Never saw that thing (as for me I prefer the JetFlash from Transcend) but something tells me it does use OTi controller... :)
l> it looks like in this article they talk about the thing I'm
l> experiencing, but as it is in Russian, I don't understand
l> what does it say
Well, I made a translation, didn't I? :)
l> I just enabled the compability mode for my flash drive and
l> now it flies.
Well, naturally.
l> Many thanks from Istanbul.
Be my guest :).[/face]
[face=courier]The Protoss do NOT run from their enemies.
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
[face=courier]On 28-03-2004 03:07:42 +0000 OliverPA wrote:
O> That's reserved space, not committed
[^Y]
Believe me, I know a bit about NTFS :). Not too much, but I'd rather say enough %).
The message is: though this is completely your business, using of NTFS for USB drives formatting is not the thing NTFS designed for (in other words this is the nice way to use it through the ass %).
As for me I use FAT32 with 512b allocation unit size for my JetFlash (actually it is bootable %).[/face]
O> That's reserved space, not committed
[^Y]
Believe me, I know a bit about NTFS :). Not too much, but I'd rather say enough %).
The message is: though this is completely your business, using of NTFS for USB drives formatting is not the thing NTFS designed for (in other words this is the nice way to use it through the ass %).
As for me I use FAT32 with 512b allocation unit size for my JetFlash (actually it is bootable %).[/face]
Last edited by Black Dog on 2004-03-29, 07:44 UTC, edited 1 time in total.
[face=courier]The Protoss do NOT run from their enemies.
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
That's good to knowBelieve me, I know a bit about NTFS
Gee!, where are your manners???in other words this is the nice way to use it through the ass
Good that I don't take things personally ...
Do you mean it's impossible to use more than 88% of it's capacity if you format it as NTFS? What I saw in mine is probably about 5%, with some performance loss when the drive is almost full.And lost at least 12% of precious space for MFT zone?!
Anyway, black dog, sarcasm aside, it would be good if you share some of your knowledge with the rest of the forum:
- If your PC is NTFS, can achieve the same performance in transfer speed with your flash drive if you format it as FAT32 than if you format it as NTFS?
- Can you use 100% of capacity with FAT32?
- Why is the type of controller important in this case?
- Why do you use a 512k allocation unit size?
You're welcome. That's what this forum is here for ...Many thanks from Istanbul
Cheers,
Janus
Same here, so that statement by itself is not nearly enough to convince meBlack Dog wrote:Believe me, I know a bit about NTFS
Let me quote MSDN:
Couldn't have said it better meself... because excessive fragmentation of the MFT can impact performance, the NTFS reserves space for the MFT to keep the MFT as contiguous as possible as it grows. The space reserved by the NTFS for the MFT in each volume is called the MFT zone. Space for file and directories are also allocated from this space, but only after all of the volume space outside of the MFT zone has been allocated.
Besides, my main disk has an MFT size of 188mb and 701mb reserved, that's 0.16% used, 0.61% reserved - far from >12% (granted USB sticks are much smaller, so it won't be the same numbers).
[face=courier]On 29-03-2004 01:27:20 +0000 OliverPA wrote:
O> Same here, so that statement by itself is not nearly enough
O> to convince me
Who said I need to convince you?
O> granted USB sticks are much smaller, so it won't be the
O> same numbers
Can you read?
1. This is completely your business how to format your USB drive (though it looks like you observe this subject only from theoretical point of view).
2. My USB drive is bootable - I hope you can understand what does it mean relating to file system subject.
One can format with NTFS even floppy. The question is who needs it.
Good-bye.[/face]
O> Same here, so that statement by itself is not nearly enough
O> to convince me
Who said I need to convince you?
O> granted USB sticks are much smaller, so it won't be the
O> same numbers
Can you read?
1. This is completely your business how to format your USB drive (though it looks like you observe this subject only from theoretical point of view).
2. My USB drive is bootable - I hope you can understand what does it mean relating to file system subject.
One can format with NTFS even floppy. The question is who needs it.
Good-bye.[/face]
[face=courier]The Protoss do NOT run from their enemies.
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
I apologize for responding to you as I had already noticed your aggressive attitude towards posters with differing oppinions - I should've known better.Black Dog wrote:[face=courier]On 29-03-2004 01:27:20 +0000 OliverPA wrote:
O> Same here, so that statement by itself is not nearly enough
O> to convince me
Who said I need to convince you?
O> granted USB sticks are much smaller, so it won't be the
O> same numbers
Can you read?
1. This is completely your business how to format your USB drive (though it looks like you observe this subject only from theoretical point of view).
2. My USB drive is bootable - I hope you can understand what does it mean relating to file system subject.
One can format with NTFS even floppy. The question is who needs it.
Good-bye.[/face]
[face=courier]On 28-03-2004 03:07:42 +0000 Janus wrote:
J> Anyway, black dog
You'd better copy other's nicks, janus, not type them.
J> If your PC is NTFS
My PC is IBM-compatible but some of my partitions formatted with NTFS - one can't format PC.
Concerning other questions why don't you make appropriate tests yourself as a person who interested in such an information - as you can see I don't need to convince anybody. Take care.[/face]
J> Anyway, black dog
You'd better copy other's nicks, janus, not type them.
J> If your PC is NTFS
My PC is IBM-compatible but some of my partitions formatted with NTFS - one can't format PC.
Concerning other questions why don't you make appropriate tests yourself as a person who interested in such an information - as you can see I don't need to convince anybody. Take care.[/face]
[face=courier]The Protoss do NOT run from their enemies.
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]
It is here, that we shall make our stand.[/face]